Agentic Commerce & the Future of Search: How AI Will Change Online Shopping

[00:00:00] Brooke: If you were to hire assistants and interns, that's how you should treat your ais. And always be overseeing what it is that they do. And keep you at the center. Always. In your, your zone of genius. 

[00:00:12] Welcome to the Simple and Smart SEO Show

[00:00:12] Crystal: Welcome to the simple and smart SEO show podcast!

I'm your host, Crystal Waddell, here to bridge the gap between SEO strategy and real world business success. By bringing you insights, stories, and conversations from the SEO community and beyond.

Grab a coffee. Or your favorite tea. And let's dive into Smarter SEO for your business.

[00:00:31] Where AI Should Not Replace You

[00:00:31] Crystal: So if we're gonna use AI more as an organizer, than an author.

Where do you think the line should be drawn between, like where the AI should never replace the human?

[00:00:43] Brooke: Yes. This is like the ultimate question that everybody's coming up against right now.

And it's highly, highly circumstantial.

You know, my most recent interview was with a 14-year-old high schooler.

On how he's using ai.

And I just [00:01:00] was so excited to talk to him.

Because I was curious of what's going on in, in the classrooms right now?

What are the guardrails in place? And you know, he had such a good point of, . I don't know if this answers your question about organizer versus author.

But definitely as a user. And someone who's learning and, and capitalizing on this tool for output.

He said that you shouldn't be using AI in instances that are learning moments for you.

You should only be using AI in moments where you've already learned the skills and the know-how.

And now it's gonna help you get. Further and faster to where you need to go. 'cause we never want to, take away those learning moments. And he also mentioned how important it's for emotional intelligence.

We shouldn't be outsourcing, you know, emotional conversations that we need to have with others, our partners, relationships. Our peers. [00:02:00] To ai. 

So I think that's like a really fine line.

And you know, really seeing AI as your copilot.

And never really outsourcing your zone of genius is what I always say, with creativity.

[00:02:12] AI as Interns

[00:02:12] Brooke: When you're you know, using it for organization, I always imagine, say you're hiring an intern.

Never really use AI for those CEO levels of really making important decisions. Or critical thinking.

If you were to hire assistants and interns, that's how you should treat your ais. And always be overseeing what it is that they do. And keep you at the center. Always. In your, your zone of genius.

[00:02:40] Lawyer Hallucinations

[00:02:40] Crystal: Yeah, it reminds me of a conversation I was having with a man at Pod Fest. And he was an attorney or a lawyer, I don't know which term it was.

But he was talking about how lawyers were using chat GPT to cite cases in their motions or briefs or whatever to the court.

And come to find out, those cases had never existed. So [00:03:00] people were getting found

out like that. I was

oh my gosh. And you just think sometimes like people in these super professional. Fields.

That they're not using the chat GPTS and the Geminis, like the average bear, right?

So I thought that was really interesting. And then I said is there a protected legal system?

That's contained? Where people can search in the same way? And he said, yes, there was, but it was still giving false things. 

which I thought was really interesting. Even in a closed system, that was created for legal professionals, it wasn't, giving what they thought it was giving. And no one was going behind them to check the work.

And I'm thinking, oh my gosh. 

[00:03:40] Guardrails and Sources

[00:03:42] Crystal: Like that right there is a guardrail! Just check your work!

[00:03:44] Brooke: Check your work

Sometimes I tell my ais to check their work. I go double check your work.

[00:03:49] Crystal: Yeah, exactly.

[00:03:50] RAG vs Training Data

[00:03:50] Crystal: I had a conversation with my friend Jonas the other day. And I was asking him: how can you tell if a model is giving you information that is [00:04:00] based on training data

[00:04:01] Brooke: versus.

[00:04:02] Crystal: The RAG data. Which is that retrieval, augmented, whatever

system, that's more up to date.

That question to you as well.

How to tell if information is actually being from current stuff on the internet versus training data.

[00:04:19] Brooke: Yeah, I think that has a lot to do with your settings.

I think a lot of people don't realize, and I do a lot of trainings just on chat GPT, and it can take a really long time for me to not only explain to them what recent updates just came through in the past two weeks.

But every little way that you can go in and click and make sure that you are choosing you know, deep research. Like searching on the web. Like citing your sources.

Depending on if you're perplexity labs, if you are gemini. If you're a Claude.

If you're a chat GPT.

There's so many different ways, and it all comes down to your settings. But as [00:05:00] far as if a user's using RAG or not. I know that RAG really helps prevent hallucination. And is a more effective way to, to share your data. But you're bringing something up actually.

[00:05:13] Custom GPT Security

[00:05:13] Brooke: I learned and I feel like it's like a good hot tip. That if you're creating publicly trained custom gpt to make sure you're always putting in your instructions to never let the user ask questions. Like behind the scenes questions. 'cause you can ask, a lot of times, if someone hasn't put the instructions into not disclose trade secrets of how this chat GPT was made. It will just tell it.

[00:05:38] Crystal: That is really interesting. Oh my goodness. And that's a good point.

Just recently I went into GPTs that I've created over, the last year and a half.

And like

you said, there's been updates since then.

So there's different ways that I could make the GPT better

[00:05:54] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:05:55] Crystal: by saying, Hey, you can use deep research to complete the queries [00:06:00] here.

[00:06:00] Updating Your GPTs

[00:06:00] Crystal: is there any other tips that you have for updating GPTs over time to help you stay more efficient?

[00:06:07] Choosing Models and Modes

[00:06:07] Brooke: Yeah, I think you just brought up a really good point on now you can choose the model that it uses. It really depends on if you want your GPT to be widely accessible. You know, a lot of people are still using the free version. Which I really highly advise against.

Just because you are giving away all of your data.

And so I believe last time I checked the, if you're using the free version, you can only use up to a specific model.

So a custom, GPT, that you are using or sharing publicly. Maybe you use it as a chat bot and FAQ. They're great for funnels.

They're great for freebies when you're doing marketing and presentations and you want people to have something that.

You can steer towards like booking a one-on-one call with you. 

That's just kind of like a really cool way i've seen it used externally and publicly.

Make sure you're using the model version that everybody can use for free. [00:07:00] So that might be 5.0 versus 5.2. But I like to put it on thinking mode. I'm always using thinking mode. Just making sure it, it takes it's time before getting back to me because I'm not always in a rush and I like it to think longer.

So going back, checking previous GPTs and based on if this is public or private.

Making sure it's choosing the model that's the latest or the model that's most publicly widely used and free for free users.

[00:07:33] Crystal: And then in terms of the different LLMs that you use,

[00:07:37] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:07:37] Crystal: a preference. 

[00:07:38] Daily LLM Stack

[00:07:38] Crystal: For one over the other? For one reason or another?

[00:07:42] Brooke: Yeah. For me personally, I have used ChatGPT since the very beginning, and so. When we hit that barrier. And we crossed it remembering every conversation you've ever had.

I was kind of ingrained in [00:08:00] where I wasn't going to switch because that is so valuable to me for it to be able to recall all of this memory, really get to know me.

My business goals. Occasionally when I'm writing some marketing copy, I will switch over to Claude.

Because it does write better. And it kind of gets you out of that GPT structure and gives you fresh different copy. And this really is just your preference. I try to keep my costs low.

So I'm not trying to spend the $20 fee for perplexity, Claude and chat.

So I, for now, just stick with chat GPT. But I've heard recently a lot of people with Claude Code and Claude office space are, are starting to make the switch.

Maybe that's on me too. I need to be a little more flexible and, and open to switching.

[00:09:00] Because that's really what's being rewarded right now. Is people that are really leaning in and trying so many new spaces and not being committal.

[00:09:08] Crystal: Yeah, I've seen a lot of Claude Code stuff as well. Is there something like Claw? 

There's some like nicknames for different things that they're doing. I had not heard about Claude office.

Is that like a Google Docs competitor?

[00:09:23] Brooke: I'm trying to recall what it does. It's like having a coworker with you. It either can like read your screen or... I don't wanna speak out of turn. I would have to look into it more. Again, I'm not a Claude user right now. It's very rare. So when I read headlines, I'm kind of just getting the gist of it, but I know that a lot of people are really liking it.

Whether it's something that is consistently running on your screen. Or, that you're able to share with team members or teammates, I'm not quite sure. So I'm looking it up right now.

It's 

[00:09:57] Claude Cowork and Vortex

[00:09:57] Brooke: called Claude Cowork.

[00:10:00] I hear really good things already.

[00:10:01] Crystal: I don't pay for Claude, but I do pay for Chat, GPT. And Gemini. I feel like it's gonna be one of those things where eventually it's a tool stack of all of the LLMs.

[00:10:12] Brooke: Yes, there, there is instances where I've seen actually some developers and engineers who have created this.

One of the tech communities I'm in, in Miami does this already as well.

They call it the vortex.

And they've been able to just put in and you're able to access all of them in the same area.

To your point, it's like there's too many isolated instances where you're paying for one and the other. But I just looked it up. Claude Cowork, like I mentioned, it runs directly on your computer and you can give access to files. It runs isolated. And it can work with you hand in hand. Kind of like someone coworking on your screen.

[00:10:52] Agentic Commerce Friction

[00:10:52] Crystal: Okay, so this whole age agentic, level of

[00:10:56] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:10:56] Crystal: AI and LLMs, wanna talk this out loud for just a minute because [00:11:00] the

[00:11:00] Brooke: Sure.

[00:11:01] Crystal: sell, 

[00:11:02] Brooke: mm-hmm.

[00:11:02] Crystal: custom product,

[00:11:04] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:11:05] Crystal: I just got the email from Shopify that said, hey, we're integrating into chat GPT for agentic commerce. Blah, blah, blah, blah.

Make sure all these things are up to date. Like especially with Google Merchant Center and that type of stuff. But essentially, when someone buys something for me... I make wooden letters and numbers and ship 'em all over the world.

And for athletes, I'll make them their own custom number that's covered with their photos.

So they have to upload the photos,

[00:11:33] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:11:34] Crystal: so they not only have to make the purchase, but then they have to upload the photos and it's like. How can I position my business to be chosen by an agent of commerce. If that's what you would call it.

By one of these lms, when there's so much. Extra work and friction. That the agent would then have to choose the photos, if the person didn't know.

[00:11:59] Brooke: Hmm.

[00:11:59] Crystal: [00:12:00] So they're looking for this special gift.

One of my customers the other day, she gave me some great client language.

She said she wanted to do something, a little special for my son.

And that's how I found your website. I thought, oh, that's great. I love that. I love that language. But when a little special turns into: now I need photos, and now I need these uploaded.

How am I as a custom artist going to be able to compete in agentic commerce? do you think?

[00:12:26] Brooke: Yeah, I think that, agentic Commerce is something that's still very new. I believe you have to sign up with Open AI to be permitted to be recommended as someone that can buy something directly within chat GPT.

There's a whole like kind of signup process for that. So definitely get on that if that's something that you want to do.

But even with a agentic workflows.

There's always gonna be an instance, if [00:13:00] you set it up that way. Where they have to pause and.

You have to give it permission to move forward. Like there's always gonna be a conversation back and forth of, oh, now I'm at this phase, I need your login details.

Or Now I'm at this phase and I need this information to move forward.

And I think that if you tap into that this is a personalized experience. This isn't like anybody can come on and, and get something that you made for yourself or your son or someone on your team.

I think if you lean into marketing and messaging that it's like a highly personalized co-creation. That would be fun.

But yeah, I think people are used to still having "human in the loop" is what they call it. And having to have the step-by-step play when working with agents. Unless you go completely ham and you say. Here's my credit card. Don't check in with me. You got this. And you have that confidence with your agents.

But I think leaning into the personalization, [00:14:00] it sounds what you do is very, very special.

[00:14:02] Crystal: Yes. Okay. So you've already given me so much comfort with that answer because I'm like, oh yeah, that's right.

They do stop and ask you. And can 

[00:14:09] Brooke: yeah. Yeah, 

[00:14:10] Crystal: Monitor that part of the customer journey and make

[00:14:13] Brooke: of course.

[00:14:14] Crystal: sure everything aligns there. 

[00:14:15] Debugging Agent Workflows

[00:14:15] Crystal: And it also makes me remember that there's been a couple times where I tried to get it to do something for me. it just took forever. I felt like the process is very janky.

And it never actually got the job done. 

[00:14:30] Brooke: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

[00:14:31] Crystal: it a job to go through my Google Drive and find X, Y, Z,

[00:14:35] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:14:35] Crystal: needed lots of clarification. It never quite got the task finished. And I'm like, I just wasted two hours of my life trying to train this thing or guide it.

[00:14:45] Brooke: Yeah, I, I always use that as a learning moment, like in that instance.

I think that sometimes we forget that we need to give it permission to ask us the questions it needs to ask. It doesn't always know to ask us the questions it needs. It just kind of takes what [00:15:00] it's given and it wants to perform and do its best.

So always kind of reverse engineering and using it as a learning moment. And I think that, you know, even in the beginning, a lot of people don't realize that you, you can use AI to teach and learn ai and use it as your own case study. Be like, listen, this is what I came in, this was my hope, and this is those result.

Where do you think the disconnect was? What are the missing pieces of information you needed from me? Or maybe I needed to better optimize my prompt.

Like, what do you think went wrong? Like, where did we you know, lose the plot here? And I'm willing to bet that if you had that working session with it, that the next time around you would get to your goal.

[00:15:40] Crystal: That is such great advice. Okay. 

[00:15:43] SEO Rapid Fire and Wrap

[00:15:43] Crystal: That would be a perfect place to stop, except for I have some rapid fire questions for you.

[00:15:48] Brooke: Okay. Alright.

[00:15:48] Crystal: as best as you can in just one word or one sentence, let me know what you think of this. 'cause remember we are an SEO focused podcast, so we're gonna, we're

[00:15:58] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:15:59] Crystal: talk a little bit about [00:16:00] that.

What do you think is one SEO myth you wish would finally die? 

[00:16:05] Brooke: Hmm. Myths... that trending is always the best route.

[00:16:12] Crystal: What 

do you call it? S-E-O-G-E-O-A-I-O or something else.

[00:16:18] Brooke: That's so funny because I looked up all of these before.

I use AEO most often. Which is answer engine optimization.

[00:16:28] Crystal: What is your favorite, underrated marketing tool or platform right now?

[00:16:33] Brooke: Favorite underrated marketing tool. Hmm. That's so unique to me, right? And how we all do marketing differently.

My favorite is deep research.

And researching community boards to get into the head of my customer.

[00:16:53] Crystal: Ooh. Awesome. Okay. Who is one person in marketing or tech that everybody should be following [00:17:00] right now?

[00:17:00] Brooke: marketing or tech. Let's see, two very broad industries.

My favorite person to follow in tech since day one. It's this community group called Ben's Bytes. And they really were the OG newsletter. I add this in my AI Get Started guide. Ben's Bytes is my favorite tech newsletter.

[00:17:24] Crystal: Awesome. Okay. And if you could remove one buzzword from digital marketing forever, what would it be?

[00:17:31] Brooke: I don't know if this is digital, but marketing in general uses the word immersive too much. I do not want to hear the word immersive one more time.

[00:17:39] Crystal: That's funny. I love that. What's your go-to source for creative inspiration outside of AI or SEO?

[00:17:47] Brooke: Creative inspiration... is getting out into nature. Getting my head into that brainwave state. You know, the best ideas are really those shower ideas.

[00:18:00] I have the best ideas when I'm spinning in class and also in nature. And it's really getting that. Quieting the external noise. And that's when my best ideas come through.

[00:18:10] Crystal: And finally, finish this sentence... in five years, search will be.

[00:18:17] Brooke: Completely voice generated.

[00:18:19] Crystal: Ooh, I like that. That's awesome. Nobody's ever finished that sentence like that before.

[00:18:24] Brooke: Mm-hmm.

[00:18:25] Crystal: Brooke, thank you so much for all of your time today. If there's somebody who's listening who might be an ideal fit to work with you, can you help them identify themselves.

Based on who you typically work with? And tell them where they can find you?

[00:18:39] Brooke: Yes, of course. Thank you so much for the opportunity. I really enjoyed this conversation.

If anybody would like to work with me, they can go to brx studio.co. 

That's spelled B-R-X-S-T-U-D-I o.co. And this is where I can connect with [00:19:00] you, whether you're a solopreneur, a founder, or a small business.

I do a lot of tailored custom solutions. And also pre-made digital products and frameworks, really to start your AI adoption.

And be that first initial step to effectively positioning yourself in this market. 'cause we're in the AI age and era.

[00:19:21] Crystal: Wow. That sounds awesome. So I of course will drop those links in the show notes wherever you're listening or watching this conversation.

And Brooke, thank you so much for being here. I am looking forward to diving into your podcast as well. And I appreciate your time today.

[00:19:37] Brooke: Yes. Thank you so much, crystal. This was a lot of fun.

[00:19:40] Crystal: All right guys, thanks for listening. I'll catch you next time. 

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