[00:00:00] Angela Skane: I'm going to come back to something that I will preach for as long as I'm in this business.

That it all starts with knowing your target audience.

So it's not about optimizing for those long tail queries, because you will drive yourself crazy trying to figure out what people are typing into LLMs. We don't have that visibility like we have with other tools that show us what people are typing into Google. We don't have that. We don't know that, and.

There are so many language variations that even, you know, the same two people searching for the same thing are gonna type something different.

It all comes back to understanding who is your target audience.

What are their pain points?

What motivates them? And what's going on in their environment?

[00:00:42] Welcome to the Simple and Smart SEO Show

[00:00:42] Crystal: Welcome to the simple and smart SEO show podcast!

I'm your host, Crystal Waddell, here to bridge the gap between SEO strategy and real world business success. By bringing you insights, stories, and conversations from the SEO community and beyond.

Grab a coffee. Or your favorite tea. And let's dive into Smarter SEO for your [00:01:00] business

[00:01:00] Audience First Framework

[00:01:00] Crystal: Wow, so that really sounds like you just answered my next question.

And it sounds like, if I heard you correctly: It's the framework basically breaking down those long queries?

Can you walk us through this as a content performance framework? Not just for social but for a website?

[00:01:17] Angela Skane: So, you know, not just knowing you're targeting small business owners. And common pain points small business owners are facing.

What else is going on in that industry? So like, is there news around, you know, small businesses struggling to get, financial support?

Or are they falling behind in sales to large businesses?

Like what else is going on in that environment? That your target audience is surrounded by?

Because the environmental influences are going to be some of the biggest things that drive a decision as well. That's also in the back of their mind. And I do have an article in search engine land that I talked about this last [00:02:00] year, about how do you figure out. Personalization at scale?

And again, it's not about figuring out those queries.

It's about really digging into who you are talking to and how can you use data and statistics to find the norm, right?

Like you can use data to find that, you know, X percent of business owners feel this way.

Or X percent of business owners are struggling with this. And that's the sort of data that you can start to build your own. Profile.

[00:02:30] Psychology Levers Examples

[00:02:30] Crystal: Is that where the concept of a psychology lever comes in?

[00:02:34] Angela Skane: Yes. So those psychology levers, like you've gotta know who your target audience is. And what levers you can pull.

So like for you, a great example, you mentioned you do a lot of the memorabilia stuff.

And you know the memories.

That feeling, that's an emotional trigger is not losing those memories, not wanting to forget that.

Thinking about, children. Like, your kids are gonna grow up before you know it.

And these moments that you have [00:03:00] with them, the pictures that you take, right, like that, that pulls a heartstring with somebody. And if you can communicate that in your words, but still highlight what your product is and that it's a sentimental gift.

You know, there's that, that co-occurring phrase or, you know, the semantic phrase that you might want in in there is that, you know, sentimental gift.

But it's one thing to be like, oh, we offer sentimental gifts. Sentimental gifts for moms, sentimental gifts of grandparents. Like you can stuff those keywords in all the time, but. If you can lean into that emotional aspect.

So like for parents.

If you're a parent or you do research, like I'm not a parent, so I don't know that feeling myself. But I understand it because I can.

I can learn about it and think about how I would apply that or put myself in that position. And it's, parents have a psychological need to want to love, to care, to protect, to, you [00:04:00] know, cherish their kids and their families. And so if you can do that with your words, you're gonna get them to want to take an action like.

 They're not necessarily thinking about, these are fleeting moments with their kids. And you know, their sports and things like that. So you can tug on that heartstring. So that's the lever for them. It's not gonna be convenience necessarily.

Or, even something about like survival or life extension.

Like your memorabilia or these thoughtful gifts aren't going to necessarily save someone's life or protect them from harm.

So that wouldn't be the message you wanna communicate. You wanna lean into that, I am going to miss and love my kids in this stage. How do I keep that? Or vice versa. If you're thinking about parents, grandparents, that's another, but it's a similar psychological lever. It's that. If these moments can be fleeting. How do you me, you know, keep those memories alive, whether it's for kids, adults, a loved one, a [00:05:00] significant other.

All of those things, that's the love part that you can like tap into.

[00:05:05] Crystal: it's so important that we listen to our customers. Or find a way To listen to them.

Because I've been very fortunate like I talk to my customers all the time Like as a small business owner I'm not working at scale So I have you know in depth conversations with people over phone, email, or even text messages sometimes.

And my whole business has been built on feedback from my customers. Like I'm not a naturally thoughtful person. I'm very naturally scatterbrained and I'll forget. I'm like the last minute gift giver, you know?

So the products I create are not for me because they take Planning and you know some foresight and thoughtfulness.

But my customers have been the ones to say, Hey. I want to do this for this particular reason. Can you make me this thing? And I'm like yeah, I can.

You know And so I think there's just so much value in that. And then another another search Person, Heather Physioc.

She was on the podcast a [00:06:00] couple years ago.

And she introduced this idea to me of jobs theory. And every page has a job Every product has a job. Every thing you do on a page has a job.

And so I feel like what you're sharing now these psychological levers that actually just takes jobs theory to another level.

To this another layer of nuance on top of the who, the why, what are people doing. And I find it fascinating because you can dive so deep into who this person is and why your product benefits their life you may not have even you may not even know their First name.

But you just know them so deeply because you're asking all of these questions and finding the answers to those questions.

[00:06:44] Angela Skane: Absolutely.

And it really is. And it's about figuring out all the different ways that you can layer these elements in.

So it's not just one psychological lever that you might be pulling. It's like, what are all the different ways that I can do this throughout a page? [00:07:00] And it definitely is. It's, it is, everything does have a job.

I love that. And I look at this as the art of what we all do. Like this is such a science-based industry that there's, there's a formula and there's things that we know you have to do. But how you actually go about applying this, that is the art of what sEO and marketing really is.

And that is the art, I think that ultimately drives the results.

I think the science gets us to where we need to be. And then the art is actually what brings it home and brings in those results, whether it's for our own businesses or the businesses that we work for or support.

[00:07:38] Crystal: Absolutely! And that's what has attracted me to SEO from the beginning has been the creative side of it. You know a lot of people hear SEO and they think technical. They're like oh you know?

The approach that I have to Google analytics or like that just that visceral response I have to thinking about analytics, I feel like a lot of people have that with SEO. But I don't see SEO as this dry numbers based [00:08:00] thing.

I see it as like this living and evolving opportunity to connect with people.

So it's just it's funny that you said that because that's how I see it too. I see it as like a creative expression. Not just a technical mathematical equation, you know? So...

[00:08:16] Angela Skane: yes.

[00:08:16] Hooks And Data Stats

[00:08:17] Crystal: but going back to taking Concepts and applying them to you know some of the more traditional SEO practices What about what does a hook look like on a blog or product page or landing page?

[00:08:31] Angela Skane: Yeah, that's, I think that's the fun of this art. Like it can be anything. It could be the hook might be, you know.

Directly calling out your target audience in that first sentence of, of an article. If you're a mom looking to do this. Small business owners, we know that X, Y, and Z is a pain in the butt.

Here's how we can help you, or here's something you need to know that's gonna make your life easier. So, you know, I think it could be as simple as calling out the target audience as your hook. I think data [00:09:00] plays a huge role in written content.

And when I say data, I mean using statistics that exist out there on the web on in your research.

So. If you can, you can find a survey of, of parents, you know, using your business as an example, and there's a stat that says like 72% of parents, they took more photos of their kids when they were younger, right?

Like all of a sudden you're like, am I taking enough photos of my kids? Am I doing this?

Am I part of that 72%? I need to keep going. I need to read this. So like, I think data and statistics is one of my go-tos and favorite forms. I think that goes back to my roots is like the data journalism and, and link building content that I, I spent so much time doing. But if you can give a data point or a statistic that either confirms somebody's beliefs.

Or allows them to see themselves in a cohort or make them question [00:10:00] themselves and where they fall, that's how you can hook them in.

Our format for SEOs is very often like header, direct answer.

Context. Header, direct answer, context.

And like when we write for robots, it's super boring, like. The robots love it. The humans hate it. At least not yet, the robots aren't fully making decisions and making purchases.

So we, we've gotta think about how you can use that. And for me it's data. I think data is a very strong hook.

As well as just stating common misconceptions or beliefs.

[00:10:35] Crystal: That is such a great idea. That's such a creative way at Looking at data points.

Like I'm not very good at looking at things like that. But I can see that connection of the emotional oh where do I fall in this data set?

And I wanna add it- I'm making this master Shopify template, based on social signals and GEO [00:11:00] AI search signals. And so I'm gonna add that: like emotional data point to that list. Like that is so cool I just that's like a really great idea that. I'm already like pinging with a bunch of different things cause I would never thought about it like that.

[00:11:14] Angela Skane: It's even stronger if it can be first party data. So like if you're fortunate enough to be in a business or a company where you can get that information, whether it be from your, your. Clients, your customers, you can post on LinkedIn and run a poll. Like if you can get a data point that's truly yours.

That is something that LLMs and and AI really loves, is that proprietary statistic or data.

But that's not feasible for everybody, especially small business owners. And there is nothing wrong with citing a source and and leveraging an authoritative source to get your point across. Especially if it's a source or a data point from someone who's not like, you know, obviously not a direct competitor.

So if you're talking about. Like small [00:12:00] business owners or, you know, anything like that, like HubSpot has so much data that they publish and they put these studies out and, you know, you can link to those things because you're not necessarily competing with them if you're not selling a CRM or, or the same tools and resources that they are, but they're an authority.

So I think that's, that's okay too to do your research and leverage those things. But it is extra brownie points if you are in a situation where you can get that kind of thing yourself. And show that you went and got that information yourself.

[00:12:32] Choosing Strong Data Points

[00:12:32] Crystal: is there a thought process or a checklist or something in our minds that we can go through to come up with good data points?

Or even to determine: this is something that would make our customers take another look?

[00:12:44] Angela Skane: Yeah, I think some of the questions I ask myself is, does this challenge a popular belief? Everybody think everyone loves chocolate, but I've got a statistic that says 80% of people don't like chocolate. Like that's a, [00:13:00] whoa, I thought everybody loved chocolate. I need to see what's going on here.

So. Does it challenge a popular belief or conception? Same thought process. Does it align with a popular belief or conception that my target audience might have? Was I surprised to see the statistic?

Is it interesting to see that people like this? Or people don't like this? Or aren't doing something.

I'm trying to think of a way to articulate it because it's kind of one of those things where it's like the art in my mind. Where I'm like, I kind of just have learned some of it. But does the data point make me feel something? Fear. A data point isn't gonna necessarily scare you, but can a data point highlight a vulnerability that you don't want to be a part of?

So on my side of, of things and the content that I'm doing. SSL certificates and cybersecurity. That's super important for a website. If I can find a statistic that says, [00:14:00] in 2025, businesses lost an average of a billion dollars or something of income from cybersecurity attacks like.

That's a huge number! That scares me. To think that my business could be part of that if I, you know, got hacked or are X percent of people not protecting something.

And then it's like, ooh. But it kind of comes back to where do I see myself in that? So I'm constantly thinking of, does this data point make me feel something?

And what is that feeling and is that feeling something my target audience will resonate with to take an action?

[00:14:38] SEO Week Talk Preview

[00:14:38] Crystal: And I know you said that like when people come to your talk at SEO Week you're actually going to be providing some sort of Workflow. Can you tell us what people will get from you when they attend your talk at SEO Week?

[00:14:52] Angela Skane: Yes, so I'm, I'm planning on offering a framework for people to go through and [00:15:00] basically user journey map their content to their personas. But adding in that layer of like what are the psychological levers you can pull, and then kind of a menu of options of what does pulling those psychological levers look like.

In written content. And examples of that.

So like what does it look like to evoke fear in written content? And what are some of the ways that you can go and get that?

What are some of the ways to evoke the feeling of wanting to love or protect your loved ones? How do you do that? And like spoiler alert, a lot of what I'm leaning on is data.

And, in written content, datas and statistics are such a powerful way to communicate a message that and in quotes. Like that is the sort of thing that is going to set your content apart from being just a dry, plain old robot, written for robots, piece of content.

And a piece of content that's [00:16:00] clearly written with humans in mind, and the person on the other side of the page.

[00:16:04] Crystal: I love the fact that you're creating custom GPTs for this. And you're creating frameworks.

I'm super excited to see what you have because layering in those emotional triggers.

I feel like that's just gonna unlock a whole new level of opportunity for not only my biz but other people who grab it.

And other people who are listening right now I think they're gonna have lots of ahas and be able to just go sit with some of this information and brainstorm for themselves.

So Angela thank you so much for everything that you shared today.

[00:16:33] Connect And Work With NS

[00:16:33] Crystal: could you tell us a little bit about who you work with? And who could best identify as someone who could work with network solutions?

[00:16:39] Angela Skane: Yes. I'm always happy to connect with people on LinkedIn. And share my thoughts and knowledge or resources To help people grow. So if anyone wants to ask any follow up questions or chat I truly love what I do.

And I also love to be challenged and I love to hear other people's perspectives on things I think that's how we all learn.

So that's super important for [00:17:00] me As far as network solutions it's really if you're looking to start building your online presence whether you're a small business owner you wanna launch your personal portfolio or Create a web or claim a website or a domain name just so that you have that online address and you can do with whatever you want with it in the future.

You're investing in it. You can do that@networksolutions.com and we do offer professional services as well. So if you are a small business owner who's looking to build an online presence we do have a professional services team who will do an onboarding call with you learn about your vision and then they will actually build you a Website Using our website builder.

You get hosting your domain name security packages, professional email even SEO support and written content So if you're looking for more of a boutique experience for somebody to handle it all for you start to finish, we do offer those [00:18:00] services.

Or if you're a DIYer and you wanna start building your online identity at your own pace they can They can head to network solutions.com for their domain name because that's where it all begins

[00:18:12] Crystal: Well, awesome. 

[00:18:13] Wrap Up And Goodbye

[00:18:14] Crystal: So Angela, i'm so grateful that you made time for us today on the podcast.

[00:18:18] Angela Skane: Thank you so much. I'm happy I was able to chat with you Thank you for having me today

[00:18:22] Crystal: All right guys, and for you on the other side of the headphones or speaker, I will catch you next time. Bye.